My first post, How to Date a Single Mom, Part 1 is a nice list of what men can expect when dating a single mom. But it lacks detail.
And of all of the e-mails I receive, the most common are e-mails from men who have fallen for single moms and the theme question is this:
“I can’t tell if she likes me or if she’s blowing me off. If I go by your advice I should be patient and expect her to keep me at a distance but how can I tell if she’s just not that into me?”
My advice is always to ask her point blank (rip that band aid). But that is probably THE scariest bit of advice I can give them. Men don’t like talking about things – especially the “Do you like me, I like you thing.” So, fellas, here’s some more advice. If you can’t tell clearly that she’s into you, there’s a good chance she’s not but when you’re dating a single mom there’s also a chance she’s keeping you at arms length, afraid to fall. Why? Because she’s been here before, she’s seen the likes of you and even if her heart is telling her to dive right in her mind is screaming “Watch Out”. Can you blame her? So how do you tell if a single mom likes you or not?
I think the more fitting advice in your situation is this – stop worrying about whether or not she likes you and get busy – make her like you, earn her trust and her love.
How to Win a Single Mom’s Trust and Her Heart
1. Ask her how she is doing. First and foremost, on a date, at the beginning of a phone conversation… always ask her how she is doing. This may seem obvious but there are so many men I’ve dated who fail to ask me how I’m doing. (I know, atrocious, that’s why I’m not dating them anymore). The men who ask, wait for an answer, listen to the answer and then respond with encouraging words are the men who catch my attention.
2. Ask her about the kids. Don’t force this. Be genuine. But ask about her children. She may assume you want nothing to do with her little ones, but asking proves that you do want to learn more about that side of her life.
3. Always pay for everything on your dates. She’s paying for a sitter, the least you can do is foot 100% of the bill. By the third date if she’s insisting on paying, split the bill.
4. Surprise her. This is universal for women but with single moms you can’t leave flowers on the doorstep (the kids might see them). Instead surprise her with unexpected date plans or leave a note in her mailbox with a gift certificate to a spa or salon. Surprising her with a thoughtful gift or date proves that you care about her. The theme here is going the extra mile to earn her trust.
5. Don’t unload your crap on us. The last thing a single mom needs is a man she perceives as another person she’ll have to take care of, emotionally or financially. If you’re not together on these two fronts you may not stand a chance.
6. If you’re lucky enough to get into the house… this will likely happen on a night when the kids are at their father’s or after you’ve been dating for a few months. But if you do get your foot in the door, literally, HELP OUT. Clean up, do the dishes – even if she insists that you stop (unless it’s multiple times and she’s pissed for some reason) but get your hands dirty. WARNING: Do not criticize the state of her house. Imagine working a full-time job, child-rearing, doing the laundry, the dishes AND keeping the house at maximum tidiness. And she probably cleaned up before you came over.
7. Get her to relax. One of THE toughest things for us single moms is actually relaxing. I personally have to go to great lengths to unwind. If a man really wants to win me over he’s got to figure out how to put me at ease, physically and mentally. If you’re on a date – get her on a dance floor, or walk to the next bar – the physical activity will help her to loosen up. If you’re at her house and you’re cuddling – give her a back rub or light some candles.
8. Say thank you. If it’s your first date or seventh, always say thank you. Remember that to see you she had to clean her house for the sitter, hire the sitter, pick out what to wear and all of this while taking care of the kids.
9. Plan the dates. I can’t speak for all of the single mothers out there, but the men who take the time to plan a date out for us win major points. They realize I don’t want another thing to worry about. The key is to make the night and her encounters with you effortless on her part.
10. Flowers and sweet nothings. As always, bring flowers when you pick her up. I’m a big flower girl. VERY obvious again, yet so uncommon. As for the sweet nothings, you’re supposed to whisper those in her ear, send them via text or e-mail.
Good luck! Single moms reading – chime in and add to my list to help these guys out!
And my other How to Date a Single Mom posts:
How to Date a Single Mom, Part 1: The original, a very nice list on how to date a single mom.
How to Date a Single Mom, Part 2: What to tell a man dating a single mom?
How to Date a Single Mom, Part 3: Hear from a man who spent 5 days with Benjamin and I.
How to Date a Single Mom, Part 4: Take your vitamins.
And you might want to read this:
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I am involved with a single mother and we’ve been “dating” for 3 years. I AM going to mary this woman. I do have to say that proving that you care…about her AND the kids is important. I think it is hard for SM’s to fallfor us guys…cuz they have had the wrong guys before.
Alaina, You know I have nothing but love for you, but I have to disagree slightly with some of what you said. I heard a lot of “me, me, me” in there, and I’m wondering if you are referring to dating initially or after time?
I think at first some of those things apply, but dating and relationships are ultimately a give and take situation. Using my relationship as an example, I work a six day week. Mon-Fri I’m an engineer, Sat. I help my family in their auto business. After a sixty hour work week, I had to pack up, hit the road and drive for an hour to get to her place, get cleaned up and ready, to go out, take her out, plan the evening, and despite having been up since 4am, be charming, witty, and entertaining. I’m not saying that my life is any harder than hers or yours, but the single mom of ones affection is not the only person with life issues, concerns, and stress.
A man can;t be in the relationship strictly to serve your needs. I have stress. It may not be a screaming child who set Elmo on fire(that was crazy), but I am responsible for a pipeline system spanning a state. I don’t have to negotiate with a terrorist(I will scream until Mickey is on!), but I do get interupted out of sleep by emergency response. You worry about how your child’s relationship with the man who left will be, I worry about if my job will be out sourced and cause me to lose everyhting I have worked for. Your child needs to be read to, bathed, and held. I am working a second job for free ot help my parents keep their home.
I guess what I am saying is it is a two way street. A man needs a woman to be there for him too. I may not expect you to understand or actively engage me, but I need you to listen. Maybe a man sees the woman he cares for as a safe haven, her child as reminder of what it was like to just be happy all the time.
Alaina, a man needs you as much as you need him to be a man. You want and need him to be supportive, funny, and entertaining. But he has issues, concerns, and needs the same htings from you, just in different ways.
So my rules for dating a single mom:
1) Make her laugh. Her days revolve around a forming life. A little levity will make her WANT to be around you for how you make her feel.
2) Let her talk about her kid(s) and show true interest. if you can’t, be a man and get out because if it gets serious you have to be willing to share, and to also begin accepting responsibility.
3) Do new things with her, things she has no way of doing because of her child. Take her to the beach and pack a cooler full of grapes, strawberries, and Mojitos. Take her to the symphany. Dance with her in the moonlight.
4) Repsect her, and empathize with her life’s stresses and challenges. But at the same time, your life is relevant too, and although she doesn;t want a whiner, you need and deserve a little support to and someone to vent to.
5) Take it slow. Falling too fast and making promises you can;t keep, or falling in love with a child before you and her are right is a recipe for disaster. And if it doesn;t work, or you hit snags, you will feel a pain that hits harder than you could imagine. You become part of a psuedo-family unit, and the thought of not counting or swinging are devastating.
6) Do not be to proud to admit you are worng, and if it gets serious and you start assuming a more steady role in the childs life, respect the mother. But, do voice your thoughts and concerns. If things move forward, you WILL be a parent, and you need to know that you will be allowed to be one. Many women will have trouble letting go of absolute control, and the foundation for the future have to be laid, or at least discussed and shared.
7) Enjoy it, and don;t care what your friends think. Yeah, football, the bar, and UFC are man’s best friends, but if you let yourself really fall in love with a mother and child, you will find there is nothing more entertaining than the beach, swimming pools, and sharing ice cream while watching Elmo.
9) Don;t feel bad for needing some man time, time alone, or wanting to do things from time to time for yourself. You are you;re own person, and you need to have your center, in order to balance her needs and desires, a child, and your life.
10) It is a two way street. If you are doing the above things, then she should by then be in love, and from time to time her planning a date or taking you out(it doesn’t have to be expensive) is something you should be treated to. By now you have rearranged your life and made a commitment. It is nice to feel appreciated and respected. The onus is not on you to provide the happiness and fun of the relationship. Most of the time yes, it is. You’re man damn it! But you deserve some pampering too. You’ve earned it.
It is a difficult, challenging, and life altering experience. It does change everything. But if you can make it work, it is absolutely worth it.
PS. Alaina, I may have just unloaded some thoughts I have been stewing on. Don;t take this as an assault on you. Maybe I need to show this to my ex….
Oh, and one more thing. YOU ARE NOT HER EX!!! You have not abandoned her, cheated on her, or blown off the responsibility of a child. It is not fair to you for her to project that on to you, she has to deal with you based on what you say and do. Not, what her ex did to her to make her untrusting and suspicious.
end rant.
PS Moms, I am trying to talk with my sweet love and slowly see if we can put things back together. I didn;t leave her, but sme things have got to change for us to continue. Cross your fingers.
Jon B.
The you aren’t her Ex thing is a good one. I always forget that one because I can’t compare my Ex to anyone else. Unless they have a thick French accent, multiple tattoos and well… I just can’t compare and don’t compare. That’s largely thanks to my ability to leave things in the past – where they should be. Every person and every man is different.
To clarify – this is HOW TO WIN HER HEART – at the beginning. Good points for sure Jon, OF COURSE the mom has to pitch in and do sweet things for you… of course she has to be open to talking to you about parenting. I’m just talking about initial courtship here.
Thanks so much for your awesome insights, I’m sure they’ll help the guys out too.
I found myself thinking that this would make a lot of men run for the hills! I too have to disagree. I think even intially, in the win your heart stage, this has to be way more of a two way street. A single mom, like a single woman without children should:
he’s supposed to pay for everything AND say thank you!? I think it is equally important for each person to sincerely thank the other, for the time they set aside, for making arrangements, for paying.
1) ask how he is doing, and be interested in the answer
2) ask how his kids are, he might not have many opportunities to talk the proud Dad talk with his friends
3) we’re from totally different schools on this one, maybe because I date single Dads…..I’ll always offer to split on the first date (never been taken up on the offer, which is a nice treat). I try to arrange to pay for the second date in a very playful way that isn’t intimidating. He has a budget too, I don’t want going out with me to be a financial decision!
4) surprise him back!
5) don’t unload your crap on him….the last thing a man wants is a woman who he thinks is going to demand to be taken care of….admit it, we all know these women…they’re out there!
6) can’t relate to this one, but I’m a bit of a neat freak when I know I’m going to have company
7) find a way you can both have fun together, you both probably could stand to relax
9) okay, I agree with this one, I do prefer for the man to plan the date, but I try to help out by suggesting things that we both would find fun so he’s not planning blindly
10) flowers are nice, no denying that, but this can go both ways too. It is amazing to me what a great laugh I have gotten by bringing some small funny gift that relates to a conversation we have had….jelly beans, hot wheels car, band-aids.
These men deserve to be spoiled just as much as we do, that’s the fun, isn’t it, finding someone you want to do all these wonderful things for, that is tripping over himself to do them for you too?
Thanks MSM, this was a fun one to think about!
Debra:
Awesome additions. And yes, this does seem like a lot doesn’t it? I guess these are based on my personal experiences… this is also written more for the single and childless men (most of whom are the ones who e-mail me asking for help).
I should write a post on how to win a man as a single mom!!! I’ll add it to the list – SO much to write about.
All of this talk is really getting me in the mood to be spoiled or spoil someone else. I think I may have to use that Match.com account (as soon as they give me my password! Darn it)
Give her space when she needs it. Don’t expect her to go out, or spend time with you, every night. Remember that her child/children need her time also. Don’t make her feel as though it’s a competition between you and the kids.
All great ideas…for ANY relationship.
My favorite: ‘Make me Laugh” …more Endorphins than you can shake a stick at…
My addition: Be Yourself. You’ll always be called out if you’re not…it’s inevitable.
In general, (be it platonic, professional or romantic) I stick to the Golden Rule: “Treat others as you would like to be treated.” Simple. :O)
I’m ready to date JonB!!
Great insights, from both Ms Single Mama and JonB.
I agree with it all.
This is awesome! I never thought to search for a blog on this topic, but I’m glad I found your site through the Remarkablogger post because I’ve definitely had some interest and questions.
Looking forward to reading the rest in this particular series. Thanks for sharing.
–Justin
“10) flowers are nice, no denying that, but this can go both ways too. It is amazing to me what a great laugh I have gotten by bringing some small funny gift that relates to a conversation we have had….jelly beans, hot wheels car, band-aids.”
This girl I dated a couple summers back went to see the movie “Cars” with me. When she came down from DC for our next date she had a plastic model of the blue car from a Mcdonalds kid’s meal. The fact she thought of me while grabbing a quick meal and ordered the kid’s meal was huge to me. I felt way flattered.
Sadly, she ate the kid’s meal, so I didn;t get the chicken nuggets.
I didn’t read all the comments…but I wanted to add..NEVER assume she can just drop everything to go out. Before the kid, I could get a call and meet someone an hour and half later..Now, I usually need at least a day to find someone to sit, get things done that I had planned for the night, and just to get ready.
I have ended up not going on dates with some guys because they thought I was putting them off because they called at the last minute and I told them I couldn’t because I had noone to watch my daughter.
There are millions of single members at http://www.datingfair.net who are looking for others to share their experiences with ….
Hi- I am searching for opinions for my situation. I am dating someone who had to take time off from seeing me on a steady basis as his office in Chicago is not doing well. He pretty much lives there. I have not seem him now for 2 months. We have been dating for almost 2 years. The trips to Chicago started about 5 months ago. We decided to stay connected during this time. We talk on the phone daily. He is able to see us for a weekend to help with the pinewood derby race. Then the following weekend, I am going to Fort Myers, FL to take care of some business with my friend and she offered us to stay with her and my son can visit his father. Well, I discuss this with my partner, he ask to come and of COURSE I jump for joy. Yes! He buys a ticket and get the premium seats as he is tall. He encourage be to change my seats. I see that I have to pay $80.00 for the upgrade to premium seats and I am expected to pay for the hotel for 3 days!
I find it hard to meet his criteria for dating. He carries resentment that he pays for dinner. I cannot cook to his level of satisfaction. Understand that I have to pay $15.00/hour for a babysitter in my home town area and my son is autistic to boot. So I pay huge medical bills and get no help from his father. My partner knows all of this and that I am using my savings until I sell my horse as I broke my back last year and can no longer ride.
Please let me know your opinions on this. I feel he is lucky that I wait for him until he winds up his business in Chicago so we can go back to dating on a normal basis. This “waiting” could take up to a year. My partner is somewhat successful and typically travels first class, etc as I cannot afford that level of travel.
Thank you for your time!
Wow… I’ve just spent the last 45 mins or so reading these blogs… so much information and insight. It’s I am very new to the world of dating a single mom and looking for all the help I can.
From the info I’ve gathered it seems my instincts are correct. I find myself with a greater appreciation and understanding of patience, communication and support when it comes to my Ms. Mom.
We’ve talked quite a bit about the situation and ya, she’s gun shy and I can understand that. I’ve told her that I’m very interested and absolutely comfortable at proceeding at her pace. Patience.
I also like to make it easy to think about dating me… simple gestures of making all the date plans, cooking for her, bringing the empty glasses and popcorn bowl to the kitchen…. seem to go over well. So does the phrase “don’t worry, I understand…” when dealing with cancellations, change in plans, etc. I think that comes from knowing how many balls she’s juggling in the air… and hearing more in this forum is helping understand her situation even more.
Even though I don’t have kids, I am trying to learn from her and my friends about the demands of children. I have a much great respect for you moms out there. I just hope that I will always be doing things right by her.
I look forward to reading and hearing more…
I dunno about flowers. For an occasion, or to make an occasion, these are a good thing I think. Icing on the cake. Too early, like the first or second date, is bad. It implies romantic intentions when it may not yet be clear there should be any. This could in part be cultural and does depend on the people. After a big romantic event, like first sex or perhaps just a lovely time together, it might be a good idea, again depending on whether it is likely the particular woman actually sees that as a romantic event and not just a roll in the hay. If she is a member of a promiscuous subculture and has a lot of sex, I'd skip the flowers until it's clear I mean something. Maybe it's just me but I think flowers say something, they are highly symbolic, it's like: i wanna go steady. And that may not be appropriate at all very early in a relationship. It could be putting too much on the table too soon. But then, what the hell would I know.
Oh, and: never. ever, ever, ever miss or forget a woman's birthday when you are supposed to now when it is. She'll hate your guts forever.
Women from low socioeconomic backgrounds can have pretty rudimentary expectations of men – eg as long as you don't fart too loudly at the table, don't hit them, and that you only pass out drunk and stoned without vomiting on the couch. They will think you are from mars if you start behaving too hoity toity like you learned at Princeton or Oxford. It's just that they don't always know many men with that very different background and it probably makes them uncomfortable. That one's hard – I am definitely not a snob but there can be inverse snobbery from women who don't know better.
Also: a single rose can say as much as a dozen roses as a simple sweet gesture at an early dating stage. I've made the numerical floral overkill mistake before – it makes a guy look too keen, too easy. She'll think she has you by the balls. Save the dozen roses for something special or for after a fight (though I have to say here that a zillion red roses have seldom done me any good after a fight – they are either going to forgive you or they are not, floral bribery notwithstanding. If they are not, usually they never will, even if you buy them a whole flotilla of ships full of flowers rowed into her driveway in a gold-lined canal, full of goats milk, dug by naked nubian slaves, all singing her name in eight part harmony).
Concerning:
"“I can’t tell if she likes me or if she’s blowing me off. If I go by your advice I should be patient and expect her to keep me at a distance but how can I tell if she’s just not that into me?”
I'm having this issue now. It's doubly complicated by some language barrier issues. I only very slowly approached her, over some weeks/months, just casual chatting in the local shop where she works, building up over time, leaving if she was too busy.. Big smiles all around. A single mum friend of mine many years ago said slow was best with single mothers especially if she has reason to be cautious. This lady describes her ex-husband as "he is crazy" so that sounds like reason to be cautious. I've ran into her with her kid once (not a date) and we all got on ok that once. Whenever I saw her she seemed pleased. Gradually I worked up the courage before Christmas to suggest she come for a coffee or meal or something. Bring the kid if she wants, I didn't care. But – stupid me – of course before Christmas is a bad time to try to make arrangements with people, and she was busy. I tried for a new day but still busy. How about Monday? Maybe, she said. So I said, ok I'll come and see you Monday. I didn't, I'd lost the momentum by then and got sick for a while anyway. I have avoided her pretty much for some months after trying to ask her out.
Anyway: recently, she disappeared. After some weeks I began to wonder if she'd vanished and along with it the possibility of connecting. So I very casually asked her boss, who I chat to occasionally, what had happened to her. I was suddenly scared she had left the city. He said she'd been hospitalized and very sick with an infection, but was now much better and would be back in some days. I was very concerned – genuinely – I like this woman.
So today, she reappears. We just make eye contact as I walk past the shop. I come shortly after and ask all about her illness and express my concern and ask after her kid. She looks pale gray but ok, says she's still tired all the time. Her English seems to have slipped a few notches in the intervening months but we communicate. We both seemed a little nervous – I think that is a good sign. But at least contact has been re-opened. I'm hoping I can take it somewhere from there. My gut says she likes me, but my head is not at all sure. My gut says: she really was busy near Christmas, everybody is. My head says: if she really liked me she would have moved something backwards or forwards to see me. She's quite a bit younger than me, from a different culture (not Asian), and prettier than me also. But she seems to like talking to me. I think there is some spark.
I'm scared of dating and rejection after a long hiatus – very long. I never liked dating anyway, always amazes me when people say dating is "fun". It wasn't fun when I was 15 and it isn't fun now. For me it was only ever fun when the tensions and formalities were over, and them I could relax and enjoy the person's company. It's a painful ritual like having your skin ripped off but it is necessary in order to make contact with somebody romantically and/or sexually.
I know men that post here asking for advice seldom get any, perhaps appropriately, so I won't ask.
BTW we are both Caucasian, as the police say on tv, not that this matters. But from different countries.